De Cecco - The Best?

Forget Marcelo... The coach (Lattari) never gave Ricardo a real chance.

Zyta Marcelo was not very great ..... Mauritio ,I've already said, for me is the best setter ever had from Brazil .... but Ricardo did not struggle with the 'helmet" he has waited his turn... learned also a lot from him on a technical level.

He's 25, not 18. He's been playing for the NT since 2006. Yes, the pressure is huge. Good luck to Bruno! ;-)

Well ...little or more,... it's all relative :) Marlon (that you like right?) + pressure + 25 years ... I would say that is no small thing. In fact I'd say we're getting off topic ... we'll never agree; P

How good is Marlon and how good were Mauricio or Marcelo? do you really wanna compare this?

If you don't believe I'd like to see Bruno playing better... There's nothing I can do.

Can't compare Marlon to Mauricio. Still, beating Marlon seems a tough task to Bruno. ;-)

Just between us .... I do not think you'd like to see Bruno obfuscate your "legend"(and nobody denies that it is). But it's my idea: P Ah ... you're not the only one who knows volleyball, P
Bruno had to fight for the positio with Marlon..... not? You said it ..... he fight with Marlon and with pressure ; everyone has their own troubles:P
However, I repeat ... everyone has their own opinion:) And the same is not it?;P

Volleyset, why are you ignoring the fact that Ricardo was a sub for a legend? How could he have taken Mauricio’s place when he had first to fight for a spot as the back-up setter with Marcelo, and the previous coach, Radames Lattari, didn’t like him for personal reasons? Everybody knows Ricardo is not an angel, but a troublemaker. He had been cut out of the team by Lattari, but nobody complained back then because he was a sub. Bruno’s or Ricardo’s tempers are not in discussion here. I know exactly why Ricardo was dismissed.

I hate to break it to you, but I’m not a “mega supporter” of any player. However, since I know a little about volleyball, I’d be stupid if I ignored the fact that Ricardo is in his own league while Bruno is a good setter, nothing else.

Maybe your memory is selective because I said Bruno has a tough life dealing with the pressure of the fans and the media. Nevertheless, he never had to fight for the position with any outstanding setter, still he’s obfuscated by Marlon in many opportunities. You ignore the advantages and emphasize drama. Poor Bruno, I wish him good luck. I’d love to see him playing at a higher level.

HCLT If you talk about what Ricardo has shown before of 28 years is short. It is objective. Then you will find that then it was one of the best setters in the world. But if you speak of age and watch the way of Ricardo does not hold.
The mega - supporters of Ricardo forget that the first not to want more Ricardo in NT were his friends : Giba, Gustavo, Serginho ecc..before of Bernardinho ... and Bruno has only suffered all the wrath of hardcore of Ricardinho's fans . A kind of short pungiball. No, I do not think that Bruno was advantaged, quite the contrary.

Volleyset, Ricardo traded place with Marcelo as the back-up setter several times when Mauricio was the starter, in case you forgot. It seems you also forgot that Bruno jumped on a team that was already a champion, while Ricardo had a different scenario. Ricardo won 1997 WGCC, 2001 World League and some national and South American titles, you’re wrong. Nothing that you see on the Brazilian team was built by Bruno, though he’s a good setter. A simple comparison between Bruno and Ricardo is laughable. Bernardinho himself admitted Ricardo is way better. Ricardo and Marcelo had to fight against a legend like Mauricio, while Bruno had a free path after Ricardo was cut out of the team. I think we've had enough... Don’t you?

HCLT You do not understand ... Ricardo was a long time reserve Mauritio ; his mistakes did not make them in the spotlight, unlike Bruno .Ricardo before of 28 years has not won anything significant even in the clubs . Bruno also as a club has already won much more at 25 years. But it is useless because I do no never think the same way.:)

Volleyset, Ricardo had won something before becoming a starter on the NT, you’d better check it out. BTW, he never had any guidance from Mauricio, they could barely stand each other. Sorry, you’re wrong about Ricardo being rejected by the fans. After the initial shock of seeing Mauricio as a sub, the supporters quickly got used to Ricardo. As for Bruno, 25 years-old is not so early when you’ve been playing for the NT in the last six seasons. Anyway, I understand and respect your admiration for him.

Zyta, I agree with you. Except for Lucas, all the others had to deal with Bruno’s mistakes.

True Zyta.. surely for Bruno Modena was a second home .... he said he has never been so happy. I hope for him and for us to return soon.

Of course he won't show to media he is scared. But comparing how relaxed he was in Modena and how silly mistakes he did during for example World League tell a lot. Lucas was probably the only one who didn't have to say "dude, chill out and set me better ball", because they know each other with Lucas by heart and working like Swiss watch.

@HCLT And Ricardo was not at all unanimous even after 28 years in Brazil after Mauritio( w)hat I think is the best setter Brazilian of all time) I remember it very well.
One last thing ... the pressure on Bruno is great but honestly j do not see him so scared, maybe at first, but now j think it makes his life quietly :)

@HCLT If your argument made ​​sense Ricardinho would not have won anything :) Do you remember that up to 28 years has never won anything .... 25 years is little for a setter especially without a guide before.Ricardo followed the guidance of Mauritio .... while you certainly can not say that Bruno, 10 years younger, follow the guidance of Marlon.

In Modena, far away from the unbearable pressure he had to deal with while in Brazil, he finally showed some class, but once he was back he started to choke, the habitual Bruno, afraid of the media, uncapable of looking at those supporters who shout Ricardo's name and laugh at them, always looking for a place to hide. I'm absolutely sure that guy has potential, but at 25 he should have shown more than that.

Yes, Marlon is in line-up more frequently than Bruno. The simple fact that Bruno isn't competent enough to put Marlon on the subs' square once for all says a lot about him.

De Cecco is fantastic, a genius. His game vision is incomparable among young setters, and I believe he'll get even better in the next Olympic cycle.

what? Someone needs to check when those two started play in their NT's ;)


I told you once about this. I said on the other webforum during WL 2011 that for me if Marlon is not line-up, they are both together, there is no line-up or back-up setter. I got an answer that perhaps I read different interviews, because that girl read many when B. said Bruno is line-up. I thought okay, he says that, but then I'm turning on live stream, to watch BRA and what I see? Marlon. So why I should care what he says in interviews, when he put, having both healthy, Marlon in first squad?

About Bruno and Modena. I remember when I said it's gonna be such a waste of money, buying guy for few weeks, while they will loose in quick three matches, as it's impossible to "jump" into the team's tactic so fast. Then I was surprised how fast he caught feeling especially with Creus and what he does with him. That was probably his best time as a setter [considering just the way he played], but saying he is the best, because he "changed the team in 40 days" it's way too far. That was one of those accident, amazing one in a million stories. Pretty nice to watch, I like to watch for time to time this quick from 3rd meter to Creus, but it's not gonna happen in next 10 yrs at least. And Bruno didn't change from that moment. I thought he would, I said many times during WL 2011 to HCLT that hopefully Bruno "will come back from Modena". He didn't yet. And I don't think he will, unless he will change league for at least one, whole season.
Giba says he shows every day he is good. He is good, but not excellent. Brazilians deal with huge pressure of winning. They HAVE TO do it. Bruno has two times bigger pressure on him and I don't think he deals with it. At least not with the one just about him.


About De Cecco. He is a little genius and maybe he is not the best yet. But he will be. So.. sha-ta-fa-cap :P

Last edited by Zyta on 01:34 14/02/2012.

:-)

All opinions are subjective: j could say the same about you when you say that Ricardo is the same thing a few years ago ,not objectively true. He played some set spectacular ,from master , but in the overall gameis far from being that of a few years ago, I'm sorry.
About Bruno could tell you that I have seen him play very well in Italy ... and also very well in the superliga..
but I do not need to convince anyone, everyone has their own idea correctly.And I think it's also nice as well :)

Volleyset, you’re speaking mostly about Bruno and you see some qualities in him that he doesn’t have. Again, I hope he improves – it’s better for my NT. Yes, he had very good moments, like dealing with the pressure of being the only setter on the team at 2010 worlds – he kept hanging on. The others have to prove much more? You must be kidding. It’s clear you love Bruno and you can’t be objective about him.

Last edited by HCLT on 23:33 13/02/2012.

@HCLT My statement about Murilo Radke has a purely technical sense; the posture, maybe you do not,
for the success of some sets is important. :) I do not think that here we speak only of Bruno ... but we're talking about many setters or wrong? Repeat ..if Bruno must prove both, and may be true, the names you've mentioned should prove much more or at least have shown little .:)

@Volleyset: I understand your admiration for Bruno, and I’d really like to see him improving. All the others you mentioned had their challenges, too. Ricardo has nothing to prove, Marcelinho already showed what he can do and his limitations. As for Marlon, the challenges remain, but the discussion here is around Bruno, right? Sorry, but your remark on Murilo Radke makes no sense – I think you’re upset because Bruno is subbed out.

@Raylight: LOL

Last edited by HCLT on 23:02 13/02/2012.

Trentino plays that way for a reason. They count on low risk and it pays off most of the time.

This is exactly the mirror of the pressure of Bruno compared to all other brazilian setter.
I saw Marcelinho replaced at half of game Vivo Minas vs Cimed of Bruno last week because he was no understanding nothing.Yet these things do not mention but citing substitutions of Bruno after an amazing tour de force.Two weights two measures.But that's what I think Bruno will make the strongest in the near future.

Murilo Radke is a good young setter, but he must correct your posture, because of 2 times 5 is invasion.
Another thing ... just strange that only Bruno must prove something .... I think people like Marcelinho, Marlon for 10 years longer than he needs to prove it twice :)

Everyone has their own opinion .. and I confirm my opionion having seen play live Marlon ,Bruno and the latest Ricardo. The world is beautiful because it is varied.:)

Volleyset, you may never have said that, but your impressions on Bruno and Ricardo are quite clear. Sorry, Bruno still has to prove something. You might say he has several titles with the NT and his club, and it's true, but just think how many players have the same status here in Brazil. Ricardo could be playing at A1 if he wanted, as he gets offers all the time. He's not the same? I saw him playing last Friday, and I assure you he's still great. As for his time with the NT, there's something interesting: Ricardo is probably the only setter in history that finished every major with a gold medal when he was a starter.

Pesazi and Marchst, I believe Raphael can offer more than we see in Trentino, though his game is enough to make an impression on several coaches. I strongly believe Trentino wouldn't lose some matches if the coach was smarter and made a better use of his setter, but this is something I'm not really interested. Anyway, I'm not part of Rapha fan club. My favourite Brazilian setters among those who are still playing are Ricardinho, William Arjona, Marcelinho and Marlon. There are some young guys that had a chance with the B team, like Murilo Radke and Tiago Gelinski. I think Murilo will be very good soon, while Tiago isn't NT material.

Of course Raphael is a good setter. I think the reason he doesn't play for the NT is that Bernardo prefers a type of setter, that is more creative. Especially in transition from block/defense to attack. Marlon is really good at this, imho even better than Bruno. Ricardo mastered it.
Raphael has no reason to show much creativity in non-standart situations. His outside hitters know how to score on high balls, that's obviously Trentino's game. Again, he is a good setter, but still a bit ordinary. He matches Trentino pretty well. So does Marlon with the brazilian NT.

In Trentinovolley Raphael and a great setter ,lacks the counterproof in another team.

It is for this reason that i would like to see in the NT Brazil ,but my curiosity unfortunately will remain for a long time yet aimeh!

I never said that Bruno is better than the best"Ricardo although in Italy has never really made a difference but today Ricardo is not the same. In the statistics of the Superliga Ricardo is not even in the top 10 .... while Bruno is the first though I'm not mistaken .... I do not think Bruno is perfect absolutely, but he can reach very high levels in a game, improve regularity, but for me he has much potential.

Pesazi, you're so right. Just one thing I don't get: Why people keep saying Marlon is the back-up setter when he's in the line-up most of the time and in the most important matches? In fact, I'd pick William Arjona, but Bernardo will never give him a chance because of his height and vertical.

Many people complain about Raphael's absence. Bernardo also doesn't like him, though half of coaches at A1 would take him for an all-star squad. Pros like Reid Priddy and Ricardo Garcia (who rarely make compliments on another setter) see a lot of talent on Raphael. I'm not his fan, but saying he just sets "sky-balls" is ridiculous. Keep in mind it was said by some Polaco kid that is probably frustrated because Zygadlo is a sub. What kind of knowledge those biased people that grew watching poor vball have? Most of them don't even know what a setter does.

Volleyset, please tell me what's so special about Bruno. Honestly, I can't see. It's interesting you mentioned his tenure as Modena's setter, but forgot his toughest assignment, the 2010 worlds, when Marlon was injured and Brazil could rely only on Bruno. Can you imagine all the pressure he had to deal with? After that, I thought he'd stand out, but in next season he was the same. If I ever had to choose between Bruno and Marlon, the last one would be my choice, as he has more precision and is also faster. Maybe Bruno will show something different this season... Dunno. So far, at Superliga, he's the same and even gets subbed out by Murilo Radke, who's just a kid. I know you're a big Bruno fan and perfer him to Ricardo (lol), but Bernardinho himself admitted Mr. Garcia is way better. There's no comparison between Ricardo and Bruno.

BTW, the person that opened this topic put Hierrezuelo among best young setters. Sorry, but he can't be considered not even good, just athletic.

I agree marchst, I don't understand why Raphael isn't considered much, I like him so much, also because of his attitude :)
I heard/read people calling him "high-ball for Kaizysiki and Juantorena-Raphael"... I agree that playing with such high-ball hitters make thinks easier, but how often does it happen to Trento to have his MBs with low%? And imo he has a very good distribuition. I honestly prefer him to Marlon...

Peszi there is a lack of respect, I saw Marlon live several times and this is my personal idea about him. Definitely subjective as every judgment

Marlon,in Italy has not done anything good.
In NT Brazil was not bad.
I don't understand why Raphael has very little consideration in NT Brazil!

That must be the reason he plays for the brazilian NT, which is known for their skilled setters. He might be the second setter, but he spends alot of time on the court.
Sometimes Bruno seems not beeing able to take the pressure and lead the team. I never really had that impression from Marlon.
I always wondered why everyone kinda ignores him, but calling him "very bad" is absurd. He deserves some respect.

Last edited by pesazi on 22:08 12/02/2012.

Marlon is very bad ....in Nteam and in Italy...oh my god what memories!.... Instead of criticizing Bruno for not being Ricardo the case would be to find another second setter. Bruno has shown on several occasions that they can change a game ...for your brazilians would be right to leave him work in peace.

I'd say the opposite, Italy94. Bernardo's presence is not an advantage for him. BTW, I'm not a Bruno fan, but the guy's life is not easy.

There were statistics about his way to play from NT, saying he was unknown for other teams is quite naive. I agree with you that he's not the best, far from that. I really don't know what some people see in him, he's good, but just that. However, I must admit he has some really good moments. He played better in Modena because he wasn't under pressure of Brazilian media and fans. Anyway, keep in mind when we Brazilians analyze a setter we demand high standards.

You're absolutely right. Though I'm not his fan, I feel bad for him. Even at Superliga, when he plays for a club not for NT, some supporters don't give him a break. It's common to hear from the stands, when he's about to serve for example, people shouting, "Ricardinho", just to tease him, among other stuff they say. Yeah, he has a really tough time. I wouldn't like to be in his shoes. Besides, Bruno is always criticized by the media. I've never seen Marlon being criticized that way, for example.

Not only his father is the coach of NT, but Bruno is also son of Vera Mossa, three times Olympian, and his stepmother is Fernanda Venturini, one of the best setters ever, four times Olympian, several international titles and a celebrity like Bernardo. Considering he has all these people around him, you can see the pressure is huge.

I add one thing ... it's much easier to play and grow without any pressure safely ,while Bruno, being the son of Bernardinho, is subjected to a thousand daily pressures . This makes it sometimes irregole in the national but at the same time, the fact has become a lion characterially, capable to change a team and a match. Modena ad match against Poland rules.

I agree with Casa Modena; today ... and overall technical and character ...Bruno is the strongest for me.
And I also agree that in reality, being the son of Bernard it only penalized.